Is it a good idea to take back part of Kashmir occupied by Pakistan?

Before friends go of their rocker with statements like "winning the hearts of the locals". Read this piece by CNN> This is also a watered-down of what has happened.

https://edition.cnn.com/2019/08/08/asia/kashmir-tibet-xinjiang-migration-intl-hnk/index.html

The Chinese have changed the demographic composition of the Muslim majority Uighurs in Sinkiang. 

Kalyani Nandurkar wrote:

MG Singh wrote:

We need to to take a leaf out of China's book. More and more people should be asked, I will say encouraged to settle in the valley.  As far as possible Army Soldiers and officers/ settlers must marry Kashmiri girls. Trouble makers need to be arrested and put in Prison in far away places like Andhra Pradesh. I am sure some results will come

What a weird proposition! LOL! The way you are proposing that army officers marry Kashmiri girls is actually disgusting. Who do you think those people are? Some kind of desperate, downtrodden, scrambling in the mud lot??? Do you not know that love marriages between different ethnic groups, races have to happen naturally? They cannot be forced. If forced, every ethnic group will fight tooth-and-nail to safegaurd and preserve their ethnicity. forcing such a thing is equivalent to what the Mughals and other Muslim invaders did around teh world

Also what you mentioned about Imran Khan succeeding to bring Kashmir to international notice is absolutely hokum. What kind of media do you watch? All Imran succeeded in doing is become a laughing stock of the world and is being portrayed as a beggar with a bowl. Who brought it to international notice is Modi, who has been working quietly all these last 5 years and garnering support from the world for this decision. Their support did not just come overnight. He has been working for it all this while. Troublemakers in Kashmir are already brought into Agra prison a month ago, you probably missed the news.

In stakes for a piece of the country, there is no limit. I have stated an obvious fact as to what happened in Tibet and Sinkiang.  3 of my articles are on global sites on this subject. I have given a CNN ref below. Please read it. Marrying Kashmiri girls can not be taboo. That's what Muslims did when they ruled India. You are aware of how they subdued Rajputana.

I don't think people understand what globalization means. It means when the attention of the world gets focussed on a subject. In the case of Kashmir, it was informally discussed in the SC after 54 years and now in the ongoing human rights conference, it is being discussed after 25 years.  In case restrictions are not lifted teh world is going to wake up and take notice. Thus it's better to act the way I have suggested in my earlier post. I understand this is going to be the bJP policy.

MG Singh wrote:

I don't think people understand what globalization means. It means when the attention of the world gets focussed on a subject. In the case of Kashmir, it was informally discussed in the SC after 54 years and now in the ongoing human rights conference, it is being discussed after 25 years.  In case restrictions are not lifted teh world is going to wake up and take notice. Thus it's better to act the way I have suggested in my earlier post. I understand this is going to be the bJP policy.

Apparently most of the restrictions have been lifted within the valley. However, visit yo the valley by others , even those Kashmiris living outside is still restricted as also outsiders and already questions are being raised about the house arrest of the leaders and how long can that continue? My own guess is that the center wants to make sure that people get used to the idea to the extent where the voice of descent from these leaders don't matter . They are bound to retaliate once they are free and may try their level best to disrupt normalcy.

MG Singh wrote:

Kalyani Nandurkar wrote:

MG Singh wrote:

We need to to take a leaf out of China's book. More and more people should be asked, I will say encouraged to settle in the valley.  As far as possible Army Soldiers and officers/ settlers must marry Kashmiri girls. Trouble makers need to be arrested and put in Prison in far away places like Andhra Pradesh. I am sure some results will come

What a weird proposition! LOL! The way you are proposing that army officers marry Kashmiri girls is actually disgusting. Who do you think those people are? Some kind of desperate, downtrodden, scrambling in the mud lot??? Do you not know that love marriages between different ethnic groups, races have to happen naturally? They cannot be forced. If forced, every ethnic group will fight tooth-and-nail to safegaurd and preserve their ethnicity. forcing such a thing is equivalent to what the Mughals and other Muslim invaders did around teh world

Also what you mentioned about Imran Khan succeeding to bring Kashmir to international notice is absolutely hokum. What kind of media do you watch? All Imran succeeded in doing is become a laughing stock of the world and is being portrayed as a beggar with a bowl. Who brought it to international notice is Modi, who has been working quietly all these last 5 years and garnering support from the world for this decision. Their support did not just come overnight. He has been working for it all this while. Troublemakers in Kashmir are already brought into Agra prison a month ago, you probably missed the news.

In stakes for a piece of the country, there is no limit. I have stated an obvious fact as to what happened in Tibet and Sinkiang.  3 of my articles are on global sites on this subject. I have given a CNN ref below. Please read it. Marrying Kashmiri girls can not be taboo. That's what Muslims did when they ruled India. You are aware of how they subdued Rajputana.

Marrying Kashmiri girls or of any another ethnicity is not a taboo. What we are talking about it is making it compulsory and mandatory. China did it with Uighurs or the Muslim invaders did it in India from 12th century onwards is because they were conquerors and did not come in peace. Their sole objective was to kill Hindus (Uighurs in China) and spread Islam. There is a difference here, a BIG difference. Where Kashmir is concerned, the state already belongs to us and has been with us from time immemorial. It was originally very much a Hindu state which became Muslim majority later on. In the recent past, because of lack of apathy of congress, a lot of encouragement by some congressis, Hindus were ousted out of Kashmir. The point is now to send the Hindus back to their rightful homes, settle more Hindus from other states and provide them with security and livelihood. For that to happen, young people need to be settled as they have energy and youth to sustain in a tense environment. Settling retired army officers will only bring elderly crowd except, of course, if they retire at a young age. The point is not to convert Muslims to Hindu religion by enforcing marriages.

Also you seem very keen to see marriages between Kashmiri girls with others, I wonder why that is! That is the kind of exact mentality which will alienate them more. Also, I do not trust CNN as a media. I prefer India TV which is more thoughtful and educative medium and reports the ground reality as it is.

usha manohar wrote:

MG Singh wrote:

I don't think people understand what globalization means. It means when the attention of the world gets focussed on a subject. In the case of Kashmir, it was informally discussed in the SC after 54 years and now in the ongoing human rights conference, it is being discussed after 25 years.  In case restrictions are not lifted teh world is going to wake up and take notice. Thus it's better to act the way I have suggested in my earlier post. I understand this is going to be the bJP policy.

Apparently most of the restrictions have been lifted within the valley. However, visit yo the valley by others , even those Kashmiris living outside is still restricted as also outsiders and already questions are being raised about the house arrest of the leaders and how long can that continue? My own guess is that the center wants to make sure that people get used to the idea to the extent where the voice of descent from these leaders don't matter . They are bound to retaliate once they are free and may try their level best to disrupt normalcy.

Are you aware that just last week, an open meeting session was undertaken between the new J&K Governor Satyapal Malik along with the Sarpanchs and village heads from all the villages and towns in J&K?? It was broadcast on India TV and many of the sarpanchs, especially from hostile border villages were interviews, all of whom expressed positive views regarding the changes happening in the state and professed their loyalty towards India and the direction in which the country is heading towards. Even many of the young men who were among the stone pelters have welcomed it and vowed to work towards making the state better, confessing that they had been led astray by a few who want to keep dissent for their selfish gains. So saying that they are bound to retaliate once free of restrictions is not fair. There would be a few who would cause trouble, I agree, but the restrictions are in place more to keep the fake news and videos from spreading everywhere which are being released by Pakistanis.

@ Kalyani , I am totally aware of what is going on in Kashmir. However, what we get to see and hear is what is being given to us by Ajit Doval and other governmental sources since there is no free press as yet but efforts are being made with some positive outcome . I guess you dint read and understand my post fully because I was referring to the imprisoned leaders who are bound to retaliate once they are released  and they do have a large support base who would support them. It is better to be forewarned and expect the worst rather than be complacent at this stage. We have a long way to go before thongs normalize in Kashmir , that's for sure.

Once I read in news paper that Kashmir have 212 separatists. It is better to keep them house arrest for some more month. When peoples of valley begins to feel that we are better now than it will right time to release them.. Yesterday I watched on TV that central government will buy 12 lacs millon tones apple in valley and it will  buy from their gardens. Money is much powerful. 

usha manohar wrote:

@ Kalyani , I am totally aware of what is going on in Kashmir. However, what we get to see and hear is what is being given to us by Ajit Doval and other governmental sources since there is no free press as yet but efforts are being made with some positive outcome . I guess you dint read and understand my post fully because I was referring to the imprisoned leaders who are bound to retaliate once they are released  and they do have a large support base who would support them. It is better to be forewarned and expect the worst rather than be complacent at this stage. We have a long way to go before thongs normalize in Kashmir , that's for sure.

Usha@ I agree with you. Many people who are not aware of ground reality try and simplify everything.  All said and done Mehbooba, Omar, etc do have some support base and they will create trouble for the Indian government.  I don't think restrictions will be lifted in the valley for a long time but then if these restrictions continue for too long then the world may revise its stand. As it is Trump is doing some rethinking as he needs Pak support for a solution in Afghanistan.

I have already mentioned how China solved the problem of its restive provinces. There is no other way. Homilies by a few will lead nowhere.

I think if we go far strong handed tactics the situation would become worse than what we can handle. Keeping the separatists under house arrest might cause a little whispering around but marrying and converting Kashmiri girls will stir up the whole world particularly the Muslim world and then the situation would go out of hands. As far Trump is concerned, he is a businessman who would wage his tail once we give him a few bucks (read throw some bread toward him). I think the government is right if hiding few facts from public but as far press is concerned they have their own sources and know the exact info. If they are keeping mum that's in country's interest.    

usha manohar wrote:

@ Kalyani , I am totally aware of what is going on in Kashmir. However, what we get to see and hear is what is being given to us by Ajit Doval and other governmental sources since there is no free press as yet but efforts are being made with some positive outcome . I guess you dint read and understand my post fully because I was referring to the imprisoned leaders who are bound to retaliate once they are released  and they do have a large support base who would support them. It is better to be forewarned and expect the worst rather than be complacent at this stage. We have a long way to go before thongs normalize in Kashmir , that's for sure.

As far as media is concerned, why is it so hard to believe what Ajit Doval the government is doing and allowing select media to publish??? Has Ajit Doval failed even once in his duty towards the country? So why can't people trust him? The truth is, that majority of the Indians have become so used to the leftist, secular propaganda that anything coming from really unbiased media and the BJP government is questioned and doubted. As far as the leaders like Mehbooba, Omar are concerned, do you really believe that they will be simply released without taking any precautions? Why do you think the Jammu & Kashmir bank was raided and a number of its officials arrested and investigations started as soon as Amit Shah was sworn in and BEFORE the abrogation of article 370? Before arresting these people, their financial ties and fundings have been cut off, so even if they are let go unconditionally, I doubt that they can do anything much or their across-border ties will have anything to do with them without money?

MG Singh wrote:

usha manohar wrote:

@ Kalyani , I am totally aware of what is going on in Kashmir. However, what we get to see and hear is what is being given to us by Ajit Doval and other governmental sources since there is no free press as yet but efforts are being made with some positive outcome . I guess you dint read and understand my post fully because I was referring to the imprisoned leaders who are bound to retaliate once they are released  and they do have a large support base who would support them. It is better to be forewarned and expect the worst rather than be complacent at this stage. We have a long way to go before thongs normalize in Kashmir , that's for sure.

Usha@ I agree with you. Many people who are not aware of ground reality try and simplify everything.  All said and done Mehbooba, Omar, etc do have some support base and they will create trouble for the Indian government.  I don't think restrictions will be lifted in the valley for a long time but then if these restrictions continue for too long then the world may revise its stand. As it is Trump is doing some rethinking as he needs Pak support for a solution in Afghanistan.

I have already mentioned how China solved the problem of its restive provinces. There is no other way. Homilies by a few will lead nowhere.

And you are the only one who is aware of ground reality? You who live in many other countries but India and are mostly thinking only about girls from different regions wherever you happen to be visiting? But not others, no who live in India and trust the ones who are really making things happen and count for the country??? You seem to compare anything and everything with what CHina did and how they solve their problems, you trust CNN...so why should anyone believe you as you have no credibility in what you say!

Kalyani Nandurkar wrote:

MG Singh wrote:

usha manohar wrote:

@ Kalyani , I am totally aware of what is going on in Kashmir. However, what we get to see and hear is what is being given to us by Ajit Doval and other governmental sources since there is no free press as yet but efforts are being made with some positive outcome . I guess you dint read and understand my post fully because I was referring to the imprisoned leaders who are bound to retaliate once they are released  and they do have a large support base who would support them. It is better to be forewarned and expect the worst rather than be complacent at this stage. We have a long way to go before thongs normalize in Kashmir , that's for sure.

Usha@ I agree with you. Many people who are not aware of ground reality try and simplify everything.  All said and done Mehbooba, Omar, etc do have some support base and they will create trouble for the Indian government.  I don't think restrictions will be lifted in the valley for a long time but then if these restrictions continue for too long then the world may revise its stand. As it is Trump is doing some rethinking as he needs Pak support for a solution in Afghanistan.

I have already mentioned how China solved the problem of its restive provinces. There is no other way. Homilies by a few will lead nowhere.

And you are the only one who is aware of ground reality? You who live in many other countries but India and are mostly thinking only about girls from different regions wherever you happen to be visiting? But not others, no who live in India and trust the ones who are really making things happen and count for the country??? You seem to compare anything and everything with what CHina did and how they solve their problems, you trust CNN...so why should anyone believe you as you have no credibility in what you say!

I like your comment. LOL. I also find you have very little credibility. God bless you.

Please let us discuss without losing tempers ... We need to analyse each others views ,however contradictory it may be to ours .

Coming back to the topic , no doubt that center has taken every precaution it could think of and has done a wonderful job of abrogation of article 370. However, there are always compulsions under which they have to work,  which is completely understandable. There can always be a slip between the cup and the lip. As far as Kashmir is concerned these are still early days but one can.confidentially say that there is no going back..

usha manohar wrote:

Please let us discuss without losing tempers ... We need to analyse each others views ,however contradictory it may be to ours .

Coming back to the topic , no doubt that center has taken every precaution it could think of and has done a wonderful job of abrogation of article 370. However, there are always compulsions under which they have to work,  which is completely understandable. There can always be a slip between the cup and the lip. As far as Kashmir is concerned these are still early days but one can.confidentially say that there is no going back..

It is right that 40 days is not enough to say any thing about future of Valley after abrogation of article 370. 1-2 generation of Valley grow up with anti India mind set. It will take time to change it. 

anil wrote:

usha manohar wrote:

Please let us discuss without losing tempers ... We need to analyse each others views ,however contradictory it may be to ours .

Coming back to the topic , no doubt that center has taken every precaution it could think of and has done a wonderful job of abrogation of article 370. However, there are always compulsions under which they have to work,  which is completely understandable. There can always be a slip between the cup and the lip. As far as Kashmir is concerned these are still early days but one can.confidentially say that there is no going back..

It is right that 40 days is not enough to say any thing about future of Valley after abrogation of article 370. 1-2 generation of Valley grow up with anti India mind set. It will take time to change it. 

You are absolutely right anil, it is the mindset and acceptance that is needed which will take sometime. People automatically think of what benefits them the most and lean towards it. I am confident that Modi and Shah have considered all the different negatives that they have to deal with. Young Kashmiri's , mainly the students who live in Bangalore, Manipal, Mangalore etc are still in shock and they are not sure who to trust? I get to interact and discuss with many them and the opinions are divided especially now since they are unable to contact their families freely . But by and large they have kind of accepted that there is no going back ..

We have thousands of Kashmiri students in different colleges and even Darul ulum, Devband. Their main concern is contact with their parents and how to go to Kashmir but none of them is worried about their future with India. Colleges are taking care of them and locals are supporting them fully. No intoward incidents at all.

suni51 wrote:

We have thousands of Kashmiri students in different colleges and even Darul ulum, Devband. Their main concern is contact with their parents and how to go to Kashmir but none of them is worried about their future with India. Colleges are taking care of them and locals are supporting them fully. No intoward incidents at all.

I am almost sure that there will not be any incident unless engineered by Pak. There will however be some sullen resentment but once the Modi government opens Kashmir to others it will not have much effect, However, over a period of time the demographic composition of the valley has to change to snuff out once and for all idea of a separate Valley

@MGSingh, just a few months ago, you were blasting and berating Modi government left and right, you are now praising him for abrogation of article 370, you trust CNN and other foreign journalists who are know for their anti-Hindu stance, your major comments and observations involve the beauty of girls from different countries you have visited and how you managed to have girlfriends everywhere you went. And you say I have no credibility! LOL!

As far as I am concerned, I have no more to say to you or others who refuse to accept facts and are obviously biased by common media in India and still refuse to recognise that! So enjoy and cheers!

Kalyani Nandurkar wrote:

@MGSingh, just a few months ago, you were blasting and berating Modi government left and right, you are now praising him for abrogation of article 370, you trust CNN and other foreign journalists who are know for their anti-Hindu stance, your major comments and observations involve the beauty of girls from different countries you have visited and how you managed to have girlfriends everywhere you went. And you say I have no credibility! LOL!

As far as I am concerned, I have no more to say to you or others who refuse to accept facts and are obviously biased by common media in India and still refuse to recognise that! So enjoy and cheers!

kalyani@ thanks. you must read my latest collection of short stories available globally. "Enticing tales of love and Romance" by MG Singh.