Let's begin with Nehru Ji, he allowed division of the country into two parts
Indira further divided it into three, the reason Pakistan reacting so violently.
Rajiv wanted to intervene in Shri Lanka
Now the crown prince wants to divide it further into many pieces so he can keep one of the divided pieces for himself. Sindhiya has already said shouting slogan against motherland is no crime and threatening slogans are nothing but freedom of expression.
It definitely seems as if Dr Ambedkar is responsible for the mess we see ourselves in today, being a Buddhist how he could take the liberty to mess around with an issue that would impact the nation for decades together ,in a negative manner ! He made suure that India permanently remains a developing/backward nation that can only underperform.
vijay wrote:The persons to be blamed for reservation mess is Mandal and V P Singh, not Ambedkar who did it for the most deprived and persecuted SC/ST and that too for 10 years. Why bring his religion. Can it not be kept out if discussions.
His beliefs have an important bearing on what he wrote. He framed the constitution in a way that allowed the government to expand the definition by including powers to identify OBC. Arun Shourie has written extensively on Ambedkar and I have read somewhere that Ambedkar denigrated Hindu gods and bore a grudge against Hinduism. All this is very relevant to the discussion
rambabu wrote:Reservations by caste not only a blow to the merit, it divides the country in to parts resulting in caste wars.
Yeah sir reservations openly means that the politicians are dividing the country in to certain parts from where they can get vote by manipulating in the name of reservation
MG Singh wrote:vijay wrote:The persons to be blamed for reservation mess is Mandal and V P Singh, not Ambedkar who did it for the most deprived and persecuted SC/ST and that too for 10 years. Why bring his religion. Can it not be kept out if discussions.
His beliefs have an important bearing on what he wrote. He framed the constitution in a way that allowed the government to expand the definition by including powers to identify OBC. Arun Shourie has written extensively on Ambedkar and I have read somewhere that Ambedkar denigrated Hindu gods and bore a grudge against Hinduism. All this is very relevant to the discussion
Of course religion plays a dominant part in caste reservations....Here is a very interesting link that gives some points of views expressed by people close to Ambedkar and others..
https://www.quora.com/Why-did-Ambedkar-hate-Hinduism
There is a serious problem with upper caste and lower caste Hindus. They are now identifying the deities also according to their castes. The goddess Durga belongs to upper castes. She is alleged to have killed the lower caste god (considered demon by Durga worshipers).
I fear that in addition to infighting between different religions, we may also have to face the issue of caste war based on mythological characters. There is no escape from respecting diversity. There will always be diverse religions and also Durga as well as mahisasur devotees. Let them not fight even if the god (or demon) was killed by Goddess Durga.
There never is and never has been any doubt that Mahishasura was an evil force and a demon and it is only now with left support that such communal divide taking gods name has been happening in our country . All hindus who are aware of their culture and know the mythology know this for a fact so let us not simply go by some tom and dick ,harry and left ideas and say left is right and right is left ! Some people can go to any length to defend the wrong doings of their party even disowning scriptures !
There never is and never has been any doubt that Mahishasura was an evil force and a demon and it is only now with left support that such communal divide taking gods name has been happening in our country . All hindus who are aware of their culture and know the mythology know this for a fact so let us not simply go by some tom and dick ,harry and left ideas and say left is right and right is left ! Some people can go to any length to defend the wrong doings of their party even disowning scriptures !
Mahishasura was the king of danavas who had a fight with devtas a recurant theme in our mythology. Everytime a danava king seems to be winning the gods come in various forms to finish them off. Now the descendents of danavas will have a soft corner for their kings. The devtas are the upper castes of today who feel their kings and gods are to be respected by all Hindus. Maturity consists of respecting feeling of all Hindus and not thrusting on any particular section.
MG Singh wrote:This disowning your own heritage can only happen in India and shows the concept of nationhood does no exist. If it had the Jats would not have destroyed Rs 20,000 crore of property during their agitation.
I agree with you. Had there been the concept of Nationhood and respect in their rich heritage, , they wouldn't have destroyed their own heritage and legacy with their own hands like Jats in Haryana.
It is because a common definition of nationalism in India is still evolving due to religious divide, caste conflicts, social fractures. nationhood does not happen by a few thrusting it down upon others. It takes time. If communities are insulted , minorities doubted, social oppression encouraged how will a common nationalism develop?
vijay wrote:It is because a common definition of nationalism in India is still evolving due to religious divide, caste conflicts, social fractures. nationhood does not happen by a few thrusting it down upon others. It takes time. If communities are insulted , minorities doubted, social oppression encouraged how will a common nationalism develop?
I doubt it can develop in India as the leadership does not have a great leader. Unfortunately the leaders who came like Gandhi were not revolutionaries and that is the bane of India. Gandhi believed in Varna system and that set India back by centuries.
vijay wrote:It is because a common definition of nationalism in India is still evolving due to religious divide, caste conflicts, social fractures. nationhood does not happen by a few thrusting it down upon others. It takes time. If communities are insulted , minorities doubted, social oppression encouraged how will a common nationalism develop?
To me, nation is nothing but an extension of family. In a family, whom will you consider a good daughter in law. A daughter in law says that she likes all family traditions. she worships daily. She dresses well. She likes all rooms and garden. Hence she is good family member. But she dislikes and abuses her husband, sister in law and others.
Now think of this in extended family- nation. some organization says that they love the culture, history of country, trees, land, river everything. But the minority community is bad and devilish. Those with other views are anti national. Such organization is just like that stupid daughter in law.
Nation does not mean just old traditions, mythology, a particular community or way of thought. Nation consists of all communities living in the land speaking different languages, having various faiths and so on. Just as a good family member must love and respect other family members- a good citizen must respect all citizens irrespective of caste, creed, faith, language. This is the real meaning of nationalism. Any attempt to force a particular faith, language and way of life on others is certainly not nationalism. This is chauvinism and ultimately means anti nationalism.
In the ultimate analysis, nationalism or say, patriotism is respecting unity in diversity.
usha manohar wrote:There never is and never has been any doubt that Mahishasura was an evil force and a demon and it is only now with left support that such communal divide taking gods name has been happening in our country . All hindus who are aware of their culture and know the mythology know this for a fact so let us not simply go by some tom and dick ,harry and left ideas and say left is right and right is left ! Some people can go to any length to defend the wrong doings of their party even disowning scriptures !
True Usha, the lower caste people who are now trying to celebrate the death anniversary of Mahishasura saying that he was a valiant and righteous leader of the original inhabitants (mulnivasis) are only doing so at the behest and provocation of congress and leftists. Both of these factions have never done anything concrete to bridge the gap between communities, in fact only poured oil on the flames and still keep doing it. My point is, why such happenings are allowed to take seed and grow rapidly in the JNU which is funded by people? Why should we pay for the poison that this 'illustrious' institution is sowing in the minds of the young? Such institutions should be closed down and such agitations quashed down. Another thing that comes to mind is why do students in other institutions think of such ridiculous ideas and concepts to fight for? Total confusion.....
vijay wrote:The dalits must accept always but the self styled upper castes wil decide what they should accept. Why can the upper castes not accept Mahishasura as a genuine king of his followers. Instead they want the university to be closed down.
Not when such universities breed a crop of anarchists who do nothing worthwhile or productive and the so-called 'hero' they are glorifying is no one but a demon who does not have even single praiseworthy attribute!
@suni51