Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able?

A fascinating exchange between participants. I can add my bit. The believers cannot prove and the atheists cannot disprove the existence of a super natural force popularly known as God. Creation from nothing can only be an act of God. If not then from where has matter come. Inside the matter is energy. It is this energy which comes out in both good and evil forms. Belief in God is a way of reinforcing one's belief in oneself and this acts as a driving force to live in a self imposed discipline. The believer and atheist both are right but in the end are also wrong. The mystery continues.

A fascinating exchange between participants. I can add my bit. The believers cannot prove and the atheists cannot disprove the existence of a super natural force popularly known as God. Creation from nothing can only be an act of God. If not then from where has matter come. Inside the matter is energy. It is this energy which comes out in both good and evil forms. Belief in God is a way of reinforcing one's belief in oneself and this acts as a driving force to live in a self imposed discipline. The believer and atheist both are right but in the end are also wrong. The mystery continues.[/quote

If it's a mystery why should one attribute a shape and assign a name to that mystery? Wisdom lies in allowing the mystery as mystery.

But humans have restless brains which are curious and ego needs to be satisfied too.So they have called the mystery God. Man has invented God and surrendered to him fully knowing the reality and converted it into a commercial and control opportunity. Isn't it great?

Man has created god to serve his selfish ends. Because people are gullible. This aspect has been exploited to the hilt. And the greatest thing is being successful in manufacturing Billions of gullible suckers.

God is a notion and so the believers in different religions have different views about his exact status. Personally, I do not believe in God- very existence of God. The natural phenemenon is same since time immemorial. If there were some conscious power called God, there should, have b een periodical changes in system of universe. But no change. Law of nature remains same.

Million of years ago earth and nature are not the same as it is and there is no gurantee it will be the same. The gravitation force of earth and sun and then galazies are come form whcih source, I am asking mys elf as am theist I beelive there is Lord which is controllign all of these, but still am unable tom reach conclusinon, then why evil forces are more power ful;l in His presence and why he is not able to defeat thsoe forces all the time.

As a theist, you can only imagine things and this is a very unreliable exercise. As reagards good and evil, these are not well defined. all these are subjective and depend on individual perception. In nature, there is nothing good or bad. Earth quake, wind, breeze, Tsumani- these are all neither good nor bad. You say something good or bad based on benefit or loss. As regards social evil, meither nature nor 'God' hve anything to do. This is matter of human organization and rules framed by men. The institution of family, marriage, sex rules have been made by men only. So you need not invole 'God';. Adultery, rape etc are human issues and better do not drag 'God' to such 'evils'.

I am not imagining, the gravitational force is not imagination it is backed by science but it is energy but still to date the gravitation of galaxies are not determined, but these are there everyone to see otherwise we could not stand on earth but as theist I do believe there are things which seems evil to me and as per my perceive those should be deleted immediately by Lord but that is not happening.

The gravitation force is there. Of course this is not imagination. In natural events and phenenemon, there is no answer as to 'why'. There is answer only to 'how'. I don't understand what is evil according to you. If you believe that 'Lord' or 'God' made this universe and he will do only good and no evil, this is again unrealistic. The animal world including human and plantation live only on cruelty and grow by sex. You and other animals can exist only by slaughtering others (including plants and trees) and eating them. Sex is natural and nothing evil. The rules on marriage, extramarital relations ec are not 'God made' and so do not blame him for 'such evils'. Also do not assume that everything in nature happens for good. Eartquake, Tsunami are not for 'good'. Also rain fall is not planned by God. If he so planned, there would be rain only where you need irrigation. Rainfall is there even in uninhabitated areas.
I suggest please make a list of 'evils' so that we may think of some remedial measures. If you have faith in 'God' you may send him a prayer to eradicate the 'evils'.

Nicely explained, I am now coming to realsie all the evils are not from circumstances and not from nature but from consequences of human mind, when we clean our mind with purity of thoughts and probably in my caase it is nearing to Lord then evils gone for ever. :whistle: :whistle: still am thinking about it. Is there any way Lord can wipe out those evil thoughts reaching to mind or those thoughts are not evil but I am considering it as evil?

God is a notion and so the believers in different religions have different views about his exact status. Personally, I do not believe in God- very existence of God. The natural phenemenon is same since time immemorial. If there were some conscious power called God, there should, have b een periodical changes in system of universe. But no change. Law of nature remains same.

Million of years ago earth and nature are not the same as it is and there is no gurantee it will be the same. The gravitation force of earth and sun and then galazies are come form whcih source, I am asking mys elf as am theist I beelive there is Lord which is controllign all of these, but still am unable tom reach conclusinon, then why evil forces are more power ful;l in His presence and why he is not able to defeat thsoe forces all the time.

As a theist, you can only imagine things and this is a very unreliable exercise. As reagards good and evil, these are not well defined. all these are subjective and depend on individual perception. In nature, there is nothing good or bad. Earth quake, wind, breeze, Tsumani- these are all neither good nor bad. You say something good or bad based on benefit or loss. As regards social evil, meither nature nor 'God' hve anything to do. This is matter of human organization and rules framed by men. The institution of family, marriage, sex rules have been made by men only. So you need not invole 'God';. Adultery, rape etc are human issues and better do not drag 'God' to such 'evils'.

I am not imagining, the gravitational force is not imagination it is backed by science but it is energy but still to date the gravitation of galaxies are not determined, but these are there everyone to see otherwise we could not stand on earth but as theist I do believe there are things which seems evil to me and as per my perceive those should be deleted immediately by Lord but that is not happening.

The gravitation force is there. Of course this is not imagination. In natural events and phenenemon, there is no answer as to 'why'. There is answer only to 'how'. I don't understand what is evil according to you. If you believe that 'Lord' or 'God' made this universe and he will do only good and no evil, this is again unrealistic. The animal world including human and plantation live only on cruelty and grow by sex. You and other animals can exist only by slaughtering others (including plants and trees) and eating them. Sex is natural and nothing evil. The rules on marriage, extramarital relations ec are not 'God made' and so do not blame him for 'such evils'. Also do not assume that everything in nature happens for good. Eartquake, Tsunami are not for 'good'. Also rain fall is not planned by God. If he so planned, there would be rain only where you need irrigation. Rainfall is there even in uninhabitated areas.
I suggest please make a list of 'evils' so that we may think of some remedial measures. If you have faith in 'God' you may send him a prayer to eradicate the 'evils'.

Nicely explained, I am now coming to realsie all the evils are not from circumstances and not from nature but from consequences of human mind, when we clean our mind with purity of thoughts and probably in my caase it is nearing to Lord then evils gone for ever. :whistle: :whistle: still am thinking about it. Is there any way Lord can wipe out those evil thoughts reaching to mind or those thoughts are not evil but I am considering it as evil?

We cannot do much about evil done by others. But it is possible to control own activities. There is a biblical quote- Do to others as you would be done by. When doing anything just put ytourself in other's position. For example: you don't like that anyone insult or hurt you. So you should also not insult or hurt anyone.

My definition of God is a man who does good to others and to the society. I see God in Mahtma Gandhi. I see god in a landscape that causes solace to the mind and soul.

According to your definition, God is just any good human being. Thus you have no belief in the notion of some super power exercising control over the universe. I describe myself as an atheist. You also appear atheist but have covered this by changing the definition of God.

In fact i'm not an atheist, but a Rationalist. I see everything in real perspective

My definition of God is a man who does good to others and to the society. I see God in Mahtma Gandhi. I see god in a landscape that causes solace to the mind and soul.

According to your definition, God is just any good human being. Thus you have no belief in the notion of some super power exercising control over the universe. I describe myself as an atheist. You also appear atheist but have covered this by changing the definition of God.

In fact i'm not an atheist, but a Rationalist. I see everything in real perspective

You have liberty to describe yourself in any way. Atheist is one who does not belive in God in the sense of omnipotent, omnipresent Supreme being the Creator. For you, this is not meaning of God. You define God very differently.

My definition of God is a man who does good to others and to the society. I see God in Mahtma Gandhi. I see god in a landscape that causes solace to the mind and soul.

According to your definition, God is just any good human being. Thus you have no belief in the notion of some super power exercising control over the universe. I describe myself as an atheist. You also appear atheist but have covered this by changing the definition of God.

In fact i'm not an atheist, but a Rationalist. I see everything in real perspective

You have liberty to describe yourself in any way. Atheist is one who does not belive in God in the sense of omnipotent, omnipresent Supreme being the Creator. For you, this is not meaning of God. You define God very differently.

That's my way of seeing the things which is the characteristic of a Rationalist.

My definition of God is a man who does good to others and to the society. I see God in Mahtma Gandhi. I see god in a landscape that causes solace to the mind and soul.

According to your definition, God is just any good human being. Thus you have no belief in the notion of some super power exercising control over the universe. I describe myself as an atheist. You also appear atheist but have covered this by changing the definition of God.

In fact i'm not an atheist, but a Rationalist. I see everything in real perspective

You have liberty to describe yourself in any way. Atheist is one who does not belive in God in the sense of omnipotent, omnipresent Supreme being the Creator. For you, this is not meaning of God. You define God very differently.

That's my way of seeing the things which is the characteristic of a Rationalist.

Is a rationalist also a confirmist in the sense he sees meaning in what exists.

My definition of God is a man who does good to others and to the society. I see God in Mahtma Gandhi. I see god in a landscape that causes solace to the mind and soul.

According to your definition, God is just any good human being. Thus you have no belief in the notion of some super power exercising control over the universe. I describe myself as an atheist. You also appear atheist but have covered this by changing the definition of God.

In fact i'm not an atheist, but a Rationalist. I see everything in real perspective

You have liberty to describe yourself in any way. Atheist is one who does not belive in God in the sense of omnipotent, omnipresent Supreme being the Creator. For you, this is not meaning of God. You define God very differently.

That's my way of seeing the things which is the characteristic of a Rationalist.

Is a rationalist also a confirmist in the sense he sees meaning in what exists.

This is actually for Ram Baboo to explain as he claims to be rationalist. To me, rationalist is one who believes in things as he sees. He will also accept any meaning what exists only so far as appears reasonable and logical.

My definition of God is a man who does good to others and to the society. I see God in Mahtma Gandhi. I see god in a landscape that causes solace to the mind and soul.

According to your definition, God is just any good human being. Thus you have no belief in the notion of some super power exercising control over the universe. I describe myself as an atheist. You also appear atheist but have covered this by changing the definition of God.

In fact i'm not an atheist, but a Rationalist. I see everything in real perspective

You have liberty to describe yourself in any way. Atheist is one who does not belive in God in the sense of omnipotent, omnipresent Supreme being the Creator. For you, this is not meaning of God. You define God very differently.

That's my way of seeing the things which is the characteristic of a Rationalist.

Is a rationalist also a confirmist in the sense he sees meaning in what exists.

This is actually for Ram Baboo to explain as he claims to be rationalist. To me, rationalist is one who believes in things as he sees. He will also accept any meaning what exists only so far as appears reasonable and logical.

Unless I see, I do not believe in the existence of anything - Athiest.
Though , I do not see the wind, I feel it. So it exists -Rationalist.
Now you draw your own conclusions.

Neither do I see nor do I feel yet it exists --- Believers (Billions all over the world).

Neither do I see nor do I feel yet it exists --- Believers (Billions all over the world).

Yes, they are entitled to have their beliefs . They see everything unders sun, which others cannot.

Ultimately we are our own gods. As we think , we want to reinforce our doubts, and seek confirmation Our ego prevents us getting it from others so we go to Mandir for solace. Mandir in hindi means man and andhar meaning self inside us. so god is nothing but a manifestation of our own self. Perhaps Hinduism is the only religion which does not consider founders as divine to be worshiped. In fact Hinduism has no founder. It is away of life as the learned Dr Radhkrishnan has said.

Ultimately we are our own gods. As we think , we want to reinforce our doubts, and seek confirmation Our ego prevents us getting it from others so we go to Mandir for solace. Mandir in hindi means man and andhar meaning self inside us. so god is nothing but a manifestation of our own self. Perhaps Hinduism is the only religion which does not consider founders as divine to be worshiped. In fact Hinduism has no founder. It is away of life as the learned Dr Radhkrishnan has said.

Hinduism is well known as Sanatana Dharma, that which has no beginning and ending.. Your heart itself is a Mandir where you can see God.. Geeta says God is Nirupa, that which doesn't have a shape or form.

My definition of God is a man who does good to others and to the society. I see God in Mahtma Gandhi. I see god in a landscape that causes solace to the mind and soul.

According to your definition, God is just any good human being. Thus you have no belief in the notion of some super power exercising control over the universe. I describe myself as an atheist. You also appear atheist but have covered this by changing the definition of God.

In fact i'm not an atheist, but a Rationalist. I see everything in real perspective

You have liberty to describe yourself in any way. Atheist is one who does not belive in God in the sense of omnipotent, omnipresent Supreme being the Creator. For you, this is not meaning of God. You define God very differently.

That's my way of seeing the things which is the characteristic of a Rationalist.

Is a rationalist also a confirmist in the sense he sees meaning in what exists.

This is actually for Ram Baboo to explain as he claims to be rationalist. To me, rationalist is one who believes in things as he sees. He will also accept any meaning what exists only so far as appears reasonable and logical.

Unless I see, I do not believe in the existence of anything - Athiest.
Though , I do not see the wind, I feel it. So it exists -Rationalist.
Now you draw your own conclusions.

Unless I see- This does not mean seeing with eyes only. This is wider. Whatever you perceive- with any sense organ, ears, nose, touch- means that you have seen. You get touch of breeze, you breathe air. So atheist will belive in these. An atheist is an atheist because he is rationalist. Rationalist is a broader term whereas atheist is related to God only. I neither see God, nor smell, nor hear, nor touch. It does not matter that I just don't see God. even if I could smell him, feel his touch or otyherwise perceive him with any sense organ, I could belive in him. But God cannot be perceived with any sense organ and is thus a hypothetical entity.

My definition of God is a man who does good to others and to the society. I see God in Mahtma Gandhi. I see god in a landscape that causes solace to the mind and soul.

According to your definition, God is just any good human being. Thus you have no belief in the notion of some super power exercising control over the universe. I describe myself as an atheist. You also appear atheist but have covered this by changing the definition of God.

In fact i'm not an atheist, but a Rationalist. I see everything in real perspective

You have liberty to describe yourself in any way. Atheist is one who does not belive in God in the sense of omnipotent, omnipresent Supreme being the Creator. For you, this is not meaning of God. You define God very differently.

That's my way of seeing the things which is the characteristic of a Rationalist.

Is a rationalist also a confirmist in the sense he sees meaning in what exists.

This is actually for Ram Baboo to explain as he claims to be rationalist. To me, rationalist is one who believes in things as he sees. He will also accept any meaning what exists only so far as appears reasonable and logical.

Unless I see, I do not believe in the existence of anything - Athiest.
Though , I do not see the wind, I feel it. So it exists -Rationalist.
Now you draw your own conclusions.

Unless I see- This does not mean seeing with eyes only. This is wider. Whatever you perceive- with any sense organ, ears, nose, touch- means that you have seen. You get touch of breeze, you breathe air. So atheist will belive in these. An atheist is an atheist because he is rationalist. Rationalist is a broader term whereas atheist is related to God only. I neither see God, nor smell, nor hear, nor touch. It does not matter that I just don't see God. even if I could smell him, feel his touch or otyherwise perceive him with any sense organ, I could belive in him. But God cannot be perceived with any sense organ and is thus a hypothetical entity.

Breeze is an example. Atheist demands a scientific or authentic proof. Where as a Rationalist looks at things on a logical way. Even the Vedas say, there is no form or shape to God. It amounts to the fact that anything that comes in to your imagination is considered as God. We say " It's a Godly Act." It means any thing good to the humanity is Godliness. That's why My definition of God varies. For me a good Samaritan is God.
They say Service to humanity is service to god. I don't want to waste my service serving the god, who cannot even acknowledge. And also I know who is going to enjoy my services. If I serve a human at least he acknowledges that gives me immense satisfaction. This is nothing but pure application of Rationale.

In human society, humans are responsible for both order and disorder. In nature who is responsible for order and disorder? Science explains why things happen the way they do, but who is in the background? This mystery is God.

In human society, humans are responsible for both order and disorder. In nature who is responsible for order and disorder? Science explains why things happen the way they do, but who is in the background? This mystery is God.

I would rather settle with 'Mystery" Not with God