what is wrong with Gorkhaland demand

I do not thing that more division is required we feel to be proud if we belongs to big kingdom.

Neither Nepali is a language of our country nor Nepalis are people from any of our states. This would be like number of Biharis living in Nepal ask for a separate state in Nepal. And if so, what could be the problem forming a separate state for Bangladeshis on same ground, they outnumber Nepalis with big margin.

Thanks, Sunil! Your views are most insightful and provide a totally new perspective to this discussion. Settlers' rights and conduct need to be understood in the light of whatever has happened in Srilanka involving the issue of 'Tamil Eelam'. Economic necessities drive people to migrate to different areas of the same or outside and they are supposed to be imbibing the dominant culture and way of living of the host country to be an integral part of the same. But whatever reasons like discrimination and so on led to demands of separate home land within the country to finally flare up into an armed struggle for independence which is something no country can afford to digest. And we have already known the fate of this movement. As far as settlement of Biharis in great numbers in Nepal is concerned there has not been any such problem so far like the one I have mentioned earlier mainly because they have formed themselves into an integral part of the country.

Now coming to the question of granting statehood to Gorkhas and linking it to the granting 'Telengana' state, these two are totally different and dissimilar propositions. Although some people are terming it formation of a new state, I would call it a 'demerger' because 'the State of Hyderabad' existed independently of the state of Andhra Pradesh which was created in 1953 by States Reorganization Commission and three years thereafter in 1956 'the State of Hyderabad' was merged into Andhra Pradesh on the strength of a 'Gentlemen's Agreement' which was so much violated that it gave enough ammo to the protagonists of Telengana movement who finally have had their way. If we keep this aspect of the history there is hardly similarity between these two propositions.

As I am already on record maintaining that creation of states should be influenced by economic and other rational logic, my rejection of this demand would be based on them. Ten districts of the proposed 'Telengana' with its possession of rich minerals provide enough of geographical spread to ensure the viability of the revival of the old 'State of Hyderabad'. But the scenario is completely different in the case of demands of creation of "Gorkhaland' . It is a tiny hilly region with little scope for further development as tinkering with it so called development can result in cataclysmic consequences which we have already experienced in Uttarakhand. It is the main reason these Gorkha leaders are desperately trying to lay claim to parts of plains which are not theirs. These are peopled by Lepchas, Adivasis who are violently opposed to 'Gorkha' hegemony.

Lastly I would point to the security risks which have been largely and astonishingly missed by some of my friends. Given to the state of our relations with Nepal and more importantly China, would it at all be advisable to engage and indulge in such a dangerous exercise? China has been ever active to foment trouble in border areas and God knows what would happen if it acts in concert with Nepal in opening up another theater of confrontation in this part of the region. If vivisection of West Bengal satisfies a few, let them be happy but why the paramount national interest should be sacrificed?? A rational response would be to declare this part a Union Territory.

Neither Nepali is a language of our country nor Nepalis are people from any of our states. This would be like number of Biharis living in Nepal ask for a separate state in Nepal. And if so, what could be the problem forming a separate state for Bangladeshis on same ground, they outnumber Nepalis with big margin.

Thanks, Sunil! Your views are most insightful and provide a totally new perspective to this discussion. Settlers' rights and conduct need to be understood in the light of whatever has happened in Srilanka involving the issue of 'Tamil Eelam'. Economic necessities drive people to migrate to different areas of the same or outside and they are supposed to be imbibing the dominant culture and way of living of the host country to be an integral part of the same. But whatever reasons like discrimination and so on led to demands of separate home land within the country to finally flare up into an armed struggle for independence which is something no country can afford to digest. And we have already known the fate of this movement. As far as settlement of Biharis in great numbers in Nepal is concerned there has not been any such problem so far like the one I have mentioned earlier mainly because they have formed themselves into an integral part of the country.

Now coming to the question of granting statehood to Gorkhas and linking it to the granting 'Telengana' state, these two are totally different and dissimilar propositions. Although some people are terming it formation of a new state, I would call it a 'demerger' because 'the State of Hyderabad' existed independently of the state of Andhra Pradesh which was created in 1953 by States Reorganization Commission and three years thereafter in 1956 'the State of Hyderabad' was merged into Andhra Pradesh on the strength of a 'Gentlemen's Agreement' which was so much violated that it gave enough ammo to the protagonists of Telengana movement who finally have had their way. If we keep this aspect of the history there is hardly similarity between these two propositions.

As I am already on record maintaining that creation of states should be influenced by economic and other rational logic, my rejection of this demand would be based on them. Ten districts of the proposed 'Telengana' with its possession of rich minerals provide enough of geographical spread to ensure the viability of the revival of the old 'State of Hyderabad'. But the scenario is completely different in the case of demands of creation of "Gorkhaland' . It is a tiny hilly region with little scope for further development as tinkering with it so called development can result in cataclysmic consequences which we have already experienced in Uttarakhand. It is the main reason these Gorkha leaders are desperately trying to lay claim to parts of plains which are not theirs. These are peopled by Lepchas, Adivasis who are violently opposed to 'Gorkha' hegemony.

Lastly I would point to the security risks which have been largely and astonishingly missed by some of my friends. Given to the state of our relations with Nepal and more importantly China, would it at all be advisable to engage and indulge in such a dangerous exercise? China has been ever active to foment trouble in border areas and God knows what would happen if it acts in concert with Nepal in opening up another theater of confrontation in this part of the region. If vivisection of West Bengal satisfies a few, let them be happy but why the paramount national interest should be sacrificed?? A rational response would be to declare this part a Union Territory.

It will be unfair to deny separate statehood to Gurkha Land on security grounds. Separate identity is already accepted by acceding to autonomy though within west Bengal. The security argument is nothing but indirect suspicion on patriotism of Indian Gurkhas just as many of saffron block do for minority community. All aspects can be discussed in high level meeting and appropriate decision taken. It is surprising that very proposal to meet the central leaders by Gurkha leaders is being made an issue by the West Bengal C.M.

We should keep in mind that Nepalis and Nepal government is under influence of China and working in close association with Chinese agencies in different sectors including border roads, rail and dams etc which will harm Indian interests to great extent. If we form a state a state right on their border for them, that would be like another Arunachal or Nagaland for their comfort. Subhash Ghising and alike were well known for their affiliation with such agencies.

If this situation is going on then soon we will get atleast fifty states in India. UP are also demanding(maya).

The special status of Gorkha Land is already recognized as the region enjoys special status in West Bengal state. Then what is wrong in giving separate statehood to Gorkhaland? Incidentally, many states were formed on basis of language- Telugu, Tamil, Malyalam. Then what is wrong in forming a separate Gorkhaland state on basis of Nepali language?

http://ibnlive.in.com/news/telangana-decision-renews-gorkhaland-demand-mamata-hits-out-at-upa/410777-37-64.html

It may me be possible that after some time Nepal will claim that Gorkhaland is ours. In my district Punjabi is speaking language. It means Punjabi can claim seprate state.

The special status of Gorkha Land is already recognized as the region enjoys special status in West Bengal state. Then what is wrong in giving separate statehood to Gorkhaland? Incidentally, many states were formed on basis of language- Telugu, Tamil, Malyalam. Then what is wrong in forming a separate Gorkhaland state on basis of Nepali language?

http://ibnlive.in.com/news/telangana-decision-renews-gorkhaland-demand-mamata-hits-out-at-upa/410777-37-64.html

It may me be possible that after some time Nepal will claim that Gorkhaland is ours. In my district Punjabi is speaking language. It means Punjabi can claim seprate state.

The legitimacy of demand for Gorkhaland is proved by the very fact that all political parties in West Bengal favor autonomy to the region but within the state. Why limit to autonomy in the state? why not statehood. The issue is only foolhardiness and ego or West Bengal politicians. The district, town and streets speaking any languages cannot be compared to larger area like North Bengal including Darjeeling. Such comparison is ridiculous.

However, as the Gorkhaland movement leaders are going to talk with central government, the general strike should not be indefinite and some breathing space need be given to all to discuss the issue and resolve it.

http://indiatoday.intoday.in/story/indefinite-strike-in-darjeeling-from-saturday-to-press-for-gorkhaland/1/297387.html

The special status of Gorkha Land is already recognized as the region enjoys special status in West Bengal state. Then what is wrong in giving separate statehood to Gorkhaland? Incidentally, many states were formed on basis of language- Telugu, Tamil, Malyalam. Then what is wrong in forming a separate Gorkhaland state on basis of Nepali language?

http://ibnlive.in.com/news/telangana-decision-renews-gorkhaland-demand-mamata-hits-out-at-upa/410777-37-64.html

It may me be possible that after some time Nepal will claim that Gorkhaland is ours. In my district Punjabi is speaking language. It means Punjabi can claim seprate state.

I have visited your city many times over, Punjabi is main language there because the city is close to Punjab of India and Pakistan is close by from where most of the people migrated after partition. Nobody is going to claim that area as it is as good as Punjab.

The special status of Gorkha Land is already recognized as the region enjoys special status in West Bengal state. Then what is wrong in giving separate statehood to Gorkhaland? Incidentally, many states were formed on basis of language- Telugu, Tamil, Malyalam. Then what is wrong in forming a separate Gorkhaland state on basis of Nepali language?

http://ibnlive.in.com/news/telangana-decision-renews-gorkhaland-demand-mamata-hits-out-at-upa/410777-37-64.html

It may me be possible that after some time Nepal will claim that Gorkhaland is ours. In my district Punjabi is speaking language. It means Punjabi can claim seprate state.

The legitimacy of demand for Gorkhaland is proved by the very fact that all political parties in West Bengal favor autonomy to the region but within the state. Why limit to autonomy in the state? why not statehood. The issue is only foolhardiness and ego or West Bengal politicians. The district, town and streets speaking any languages cannot be compared to larger area like North Bengal including Darjeeling. Such comparison is ridiculous.

However, as the Gorkhaland movement leaders are going to talk with central government, the general strike should not be indefinite and some breathing space need be given to all to discuss the issue and resolve it.

http://indiatoday.intoday.in/story/indefinite-strike-in-darjeeling-from-saturday-to-press-for-gorkhaland/1/297387.html

Why did they agree to the formation of Gorkhaland Hill Council in the first place and backing out now? What material changes have taken place to justify the demand of statehood over the last one year? As far your calling the leaders of all parties in West Bengal with choicest and not so charitable terms , I am happy with their being 'foolhardy', 'egoistic' and all that you have been generously heaping upon them. Thank God, that they have been sane this time around on this issue!!!! And if you care to go through the pages of history you would meet many more 'foolhardy' and 'egoistic' Bengali leaders like Netaji Subhas Chandra Bose, Deshbandhu C.R.Das and others who never thought through such narrow political prism. What about Rabindranath Tagore and his celebrated poem ' where mind is without fear'? Need I quote and happy to do so!!

Where The Mind Is Without Fear
Where the mind is without fear and the head is held high
Where knowledge is free
Where the world has not been broken up into fragments
By narrow domestic walls
Where words come out from the depth of truth
Where tireless striving stretches its arms towards perfection
Where the clear stream of reason has not lost its way
Into the dreary desert sand of dead habit
Where the mind is led forward by thee
Into ever-widening thought and action
Into that heaven of freedom, my Father, let my country awake.

As I had been in those areas in question here for long at different time periods and I am fully aware that problem of Gurkhas is not limited to Darjeeling and surrounding area alone. Nepalese live in other parts of India as well like Assam, UP and Punjab in substantial numbers. However they are here as outsiders who are allowed to stay here without any papers and can work here also. People from India also go outside to work and allowed to stay there permanently but they are not granted any states for them in those countries in spite of they are officially called to work and support those countries develop.

The special status of Gorkha Land is already recognized as the region enjoys special status in West Bengal state. Then what is wrong in giving separate statehood to Gorkhaland? Incidentally, many states were formed on basis of language- Telugu, Tamil, Malyalam. Then what is wrong in forming a separate Gorkhaland state on basis of Nepali language?

http://ibnlive.in.com/news/telangana-decision-renews-gorkhaland-demand-mamata-hits-out-at-upa/410777-37-64.html

It may me be possible that after some time Nepal will claim that Gorkhaland is ours. In my district Punjabi is speaking language. It means Punjabi can claim seprate state.

The legitimacy of demand for Gorkhaland is proved by the very fact that all political parties in West Bengal favor autonomy to the region but within the state. Why limit to autonomy in the state? why not statehood. The issue is only foolhardiness and ego or West Bengal politicians. The district, town and streets speaking any languages cannot be compared to larger area like North Bengal including Darjeeling. Such comparison is ridiculous.

However, as the Gorkhaland movement leaders are going to talk with central government, the general strike should not be indefinite and some breathing space need be given to all to discuss the issue and resolve it.

http://indiatoday.intoday.in/story/indefinite-strike-in-darjeeling-from-saturday-to-press-for-gorkhaland/1/297387.html

Why did they agree to the formation of Gorkhaland Hill Council in the first place and backing out now? What material changes have taken place to justify the demand of statehood over the last one year? As far your calling the leaders of all parties in West Bengal with choicest and not so charitable terms , I am happy with their being 'foolhardy', 'egoistic' and all that you have been generously heaping upon them. Thank God, that they have been sane this time around on this issue!!!! And if you care to go through the pages of history you would meet many more 'foolhardy' and 'egoistic' Bengali leaders like Netaji Subhas Chandra Bose, Deshbandhu C.R.Das and others who never thought through such narrow political prism. What about Rabindranath Tagore and his celebrated poem ' where mind is without fear'? Need I quote and happy to do so!!

Where The Mind Is Without Fear
Where the mind is without fear and the head is held high
Where knowledge is free
Where the world has not been broken up into fragments
By narrow domestic walls
Where words come out from the depth of truth
Where tireless striving stretches its arms towards perfection
Where the clear stream of reason has not lost its way
Into the dreary desert sand of dead habit
Where the mind is led forward by thee
Into ever-widening thought and action
Into that heaven of freedom, my Father, let my country awake.

The very formation of Gorkhaland Hill Council proves that the region has a distinct identity. Then why should West Bengal insist on retaining the region while agreeing to give autonomy. The comments are only in context of the current Gorkhaland issue and are not in any way related to other matters and historic personalities. Incidentally, Darjeeling was not in Bengal before independence.

Here is a link that clearly establishes that the region of Darjeeling and around was never part of Bengal. For administrative convenience, some arrangement was made by British. Ironically, the West Bengal politicians have been encouraging Bangladeshi illegal migrants and using them as vote bank to rule in the region.

http://www.merinews.com/article/history-proves-that-darjeeling-was-never-a-part-of-bengal/15888926.shtml

Here is a link that clearly establishes that the region of Darjeeling and around was never part of Bengal. For administrative convenience, some arrangement was made by British. Ironically, the West Bengal politicians have been encouraging Bangladeshi illegal migrants and using them as vote bank to rule in the region.

http://www.merinews.com/article/history-proves-that-darjeeling-was-never-a-part-of-bengal/15888926.shtml

It is not my wont to look to links to justify what I don't consider in my heart of hearts to be in line with whatever little knowledge I have I never arm myself with secondary sources. If historical wrongs and rights are restored then the entire world would wear a radically different look altogether! Some eminent historians and our politicians like Sardar Patel and Pandit Nehru never expressed themselves in favor of linguistic or sub-national states as they were acutely aware of the fact that India's past subjugation owed to internecine and fratricidal wars which provided ample scope and opportunities for invaders to establish their rule by following the infamous ' divide and rule'. It is amazing that even in Post-Independent India our politicians have been indulging in this most destructive game of vivisection of India. If you are all for it, I have nothing further to add except to reminisce some funny incidents yet not devoid of meanings in our childhood days. There used to be football matches among various localities of our town and any result would trigger off violence such was intensity of local. divisive feelings. I wonder if you are not pandering to the baser sub-nationalism of Gorkhas. West Bengal's loss is not necessarily India's gain after all all we are Indians!!!

The special status of Gorkha Land is already recognized as the region enjoys special status in West Bengal state. Then what is wrong in giving separate statehood to Gorkhaland? Incidentally, many states were formed on basis of language- Telugu, Tamil, Malyalam. Then what is wrong in forming a separate Gorkhaland state on basis of Nepali language?

http://ibnlive.in.com/news/telangana-decision-renews-gorkhaland-demand-mamata-hits-out-at-upa/410777-37-64.html

Telgu, Tamil are India languages and Tamil and Telgu speaking peoples are of Indian origin. On other hand Nepali is not Indian language and Nepalies are also not of Indian origin. Large number of Nepali are also living in Uttrakhand. It may be possible that after some time Nepal will claim that Gorkhaland is part of Nepal.

The special status of Gorkha Land is already recognized as the region enjoys special status in West Bengal state. Then what is wrong in giving separate statehood to Gorkhaland? Incidentally, many states were formed on basis of language- Telugu, Tamil, Malyalam. Then what is wrong in forming a separate Gorkhaland state on basis of Nepali language?

http://ibnlive.in.com/news/telangana-decision-renews-gorkhaland-demand-mamata-hits-out-at-upa/410777-37-64.html

Telgu, Tamil are India languages and Tamil and Telgu speaking peoples are of Indian origin. On other hand Nepali is not Indian language and Nepalies are also not of Indian origin. Large number of Nepali are also living in Uttrakhand. It may be possible that after some time Nepal will claim that Gorkhaland is part of Nepal.

Quite a possibility!! Then we would have more than one 'Gorkhaland' in India!!!
{CJATTACHMENT ["id": 10780]}

The issue of Gorkhaland may be debatable. It is for all parties to discuss the issue without preconceived notions in an environment of mutual trust and good will. But there is no attempt in that direction. Instead the West Bengal government is suppressing the movement with heavy hand. Also some local channels in the region have been blocked. Apparently, freedom of expression is first casualty.

http://www.hindustantimes.com/India-news/WestBengal/Bengal-govt-closes-local-news-channel-in-Darjeeling/Article1-1106358.aspx

It needs be kept in mind that Gorkhaland demand is not for separation. This is just for separate state within India, which is as good or bad as similar demand elsewhere. Reorganization of territory as a new state or union territory should not be considered a loss for the West Bengal state. Unfortunately, west Bengal government is behaving strangely.

The special status of Gorkha Land is already recognized as the region enjoys special status in West Bengal state. Then what is wrong in giving separate statehood to Gorkhaland? Incidentally, many states were formed on basis of language- Telugu, Tamil, Malyalam. Then what is wrong in forming a separate Gorkhaland state on basis of Nepali language?

http://ibnlive.in.com/news/telangana-decision-renews-gorkhaland-demand-mamata-hits-out-at-upa/410777-37-64.html

Telgu, Tamil are India languages and Tamil and Telgu speaking peoples are of Indian origin. On other hand Nepali is not Indian language and Nepalies are also not of Indian origin. Large number of Nepali are also living in Uttrakhand. It may be possible that after some time Nepal will claim that Gorkhaland is part of Nepal.

Quite a possibility!! Then we would have more than one 'Gorkhaland' in India!!!
{CJATTACHMENT ["id": 10780]}

We have many such lands already in our country, we have yet to name them only. If the same political scenario goes on, we shall see strange names coming up soon for newer states. "Divide and rule " is the only mantra our rulers inherited from former bosses. To top it all, all are welcome from anywhere and take their pick.

The special status of Gorkha Land is already recognized as the region enjoys special status in West Bengal state. Then what is wrong in giving separate statehood to Gorkhaland? Incidentally, many states were formed on basis of language- Telugu, Tamil, Malyalam. Then what is wrong in forming a separate Gorkhaland state on basis of Nepali language?

http://ibnlive.in.com/news/telangana-decision-renews-gorkhaland-demand-mamata-hits-out-at-upa/410777-37-64.html

Telgu, Tamil are India languages and Tamil and Telgu speaking peoples are of Indian origin. On other hand Nepali is not Indian language and Nepalies are also not of Indian origin. Large number of Nepali are also living in Uttrakhand. It may be possible that after some time Nepal will claim that Gorkhaland is part of Nepal.

Quite a possibility!! Then we would have more than one 'Gorkhaland' in India!!!
{CJATTACHMENT ["id": 10780]}

We have many such lands already in our country, we have yet to name them only. If the same political scenario goes on, we shall see strange names coming up soon for newer states. "Divide and rule " is the only mantra our rulers inherited from former bosses. To top it all, all are welcome from anywhere and take their pick.

@Sunil

If I am to put it more metaphorically, are we not heading for a situation , given to extraordinary zeal of our current crop of politicians to exploit sub-regional and sub-national sentiments to achieve their very mean and narrow ends, to drive out 'Mother India' to seek refuge in another planet???

I always not I favour of smaller states, though people of that region should be telling more about, as all these issues were in pause, but after announcement of Telengana as separate state hood, the demand for all the other states are now again in the limelight. It is not a good idea to create state along the lines of languages as India has many languages and this would create more problems in the future. In the history of India, Odisha was formed as the first language state in 1936.

The special status of Gorkha Land is already recognized as the region enjoys special status in West Bengal state. Then what is wrong in giving separate statehood to Gorkhaland? Incidentally, many states were formed on basis of language- Telugu, Tamil, Malyalam. Then what is wrong in forming a separate Gorkhaland state on basis of Nepali language?

http://ibnlive.in.com/news/telangana-decision-renews-gorkhaland-demand-mamata-hits-out-at-upa/410777-37-64.html

Telgu, Tamil are India languages and Tamil and Telgu speaking peoples are of Indian origin. On other hand Nepali is not Indian language and Nepalies are also not of Indian origin. Large number of Nepali are also living in Uttrakhand. It may be possible that after some time Nepal will claim that Gorkhaland is part of Nepal.

Quite a possibility!! Then we would have more than one 'Gorkhaland' in India!!!
{CJATTACHMENT ["id": 10780]}

We have many such lands already in our country, we have yet to name them only. If the same political scenario goes on, we shall see strange names coming up soon for newer states. "Divide and rule " is the only mantra our rulers inherited from former bosses. To top it all, all are welcome from anywhere and take their pick.

@Sunil

If I am to put it more metaphorically, are we not heading for a situation ,to extraordinary zeal of our current crop of politicians to exploit sub-regional and sub-national sentiments to achieve their very mean and narrow ends, to drive out 'Mother India' to seek refuge in another planet???

Perhaps we are heading toward era when Patel unified this country to convert it into a nation. The day is not far when we shall have districts or perhaps sub-divisions converted into states. That is more favorable to politicians.